Camping Open Carry?

[t_bare]

I know that open carry is legal while camping (& fishing) in Florida but why, how did that come to be?

Thanks!
t_bare

[MiamiOffshore]

Open Carry was legal throughout Florida until the late 80's. When the legislature voted for concealed carry they traded in general open carry to accumulate the needed votes. The carve out for fishing/camping/hunting was protected.

Strangely, we know have legal Constitutional concealed carry, but no open carry. The Federal and State Constitutions both recognize the UN-INFRINGEABLE right to keep and BARE arms. Surely one could argue before the State Supreme Court that only being able to carry/bare in a "secret manner" is a clear infringement of said right.

[tector]

Open Carry was legal throughout Florida until the late 80's. When the legislature voted for concealed carry they traded in general open carry to accumulate the needed votes. The carve out for fishing/camping/hunting was protected.

Strangely, we know have legal Constitutional concealed carry, but no open carry. The Federal and State Constitutions both recognize the UN-INFRINGEABLE right to keep and BARE arms. Surely one could argue before the State Supreme Court that only being able to carry/bare in a "secret manner" is a clear infringement of said right.

Here's the problem:

As far as the US Constitution goes, yes the Florida Supreme Court would have the authority to construe the 2A that way. But on matters of federal constitutional law, state supreme courts are not the final word--the US Supreme Court is. So any such ruling by the FL Supreme Court could be appealed to the US Supreme Court. I'm not optimistic (to say the least) that USSC will be finding anytime soon that bans on open carry violate the 2A.

As far as the FL Constitution goes, its version of the 2A, Art. I Section 8, reads as follows:

"(a) The right of the people to keep and bear arms in defense of themselves and of the lawful authority of the state shall not be infringed, except that the manner of bearing arms may be regulated by law."

That last clause is the motherfucker. Real unfortunate.

[MiamiOffshore]

I agree with you on the State vs Federal scenario. I was only making the case on behalf of the Florida law as it related to the OP's question about the derivation of the camping/hunting/fishing exclusion.

One could make the argument that while the State Constitution allows the regulation of "bearing" that said "bearing" can't be construed in a way which infringes. Given that exclusively concealed weapons limits there size to relatively small configurations and given average daily Florida weather restricting practical clothing wearable by the average Floridian, it's an undue burden upon the citizenry to restrict their Right to bear to, practically speaking, small handguns.
Applying a "practicality test" it is unreasonable to conclude the original draft of the legislation was intended to read "the right to bear small handguns secretly". The law could then still allow reasonable restrictions, such as limits on open carry in government buildings, police stations and private businesses that opted to do so.

Ironically, the Federal Bill of Rights carries no such wording and if applied properly and honestly, would be used to strip the Florida law of of this undue burden.

[N4KVE]

I know that open carry is legal while camping (& fishing) in Florida but why, how did that come to be?

Thanks!
t_bare

I imagine the law was written for people in the woods who might be fishing, or camping, & may run across a bear. Of course you get the “constitutionalists” who feel the need to openly carry an AR-15 while fishing on the bridge between West Palm Beach, & the Town of Palm Beach just to harass the cops. GARY

[Miami_JBT]

Open Carry was legal throughout Florida until the late 80's. When the legislature voted for concealed carry they traded in general open carry to accumulate the needed votes. The carve out for fishing/camping/hunting was protected.

Strangely, we know have legal Constitutional concealed carry, but no open carry. The Federal and State Constitutions both recognize the UN-INFRINGEABLE right to keep and BARE arms. Surely one could argue before the State Supreme Court that only being able to carry/bare in a "secret manner" is a clear infringement of said right.

That was not the case.

Open Carry was only legal in certain counties in the state since each county determined who could and couldn't carry. When the state passed CCWs in 1987, the state took those powers away from the counties. Unlicensed open carry was thus legal for about a week and no county could do anything about it. Then Dade County State Attorney Janet Reno pushed for a ban on open carry to the legislature during a special session to discuss tax matters. She didn't like people in Dade County being able to freely exercise their rights.

Furthermore, the state constitution states that you don't have a right to carry nor does the state supreme court in Norman v. State (2017). Article I, Section 8, Subsection A states the following:

"The right of the people to keep and bear arms in defense of themselves and of the lawful authority of the state shall not be infringed, except that the manner of bearing arms may be regulated by law."

It is fully under the direction of the legislature to determine who can and can't carry. Now, that is clearly in conflict with the Second Amendment of the United States and NYSRPA v. Bruen (2023).

Also, we do not have "constitutional carry" in Florida. We have permitless concealed-only carry and it is very restrictive in nature. You must meet all the criteria for the issuance of a CCW permit to be able to carry without a permit.

True constitutional carry doesn't have such requirements.

[Casual]

I know that open carry is legal while camping (& fishing) in Florida but why, how did that come to be?

Thanks!
t_bare

I imagine the law was written for people in the woods who might be fishing, or camping, & may run across a bear. Of course you get the “constitutionalists” who feel the need to openly carry an AR-15 while fishing on the bridge between West Palm Beach, & the Town of Palm Beach just to harass the cops. GARY

You call it harassing.... but they did it in Texas to push the point and earned open carry

[Miami_JBT]

I know that open carry is legal while camping (& fishing) in Florida but why, how did that come to be?

Thanks!
t_bare

I imagine the law was written for people in the woods who might be fishing, or camping, & may run across a bear. Of course you get the “constitutionalists” who feel the need to openly carry an AR-15 while fishing on the bridge between West Palm Beach, & the Town of Palm Beach just to harass the cops. GARY

That's where the First Amendment is extremely important. SCOTUS stated the following in Hague v. Committee for Industrial Organization, 307 U.S. 496 (1939):

"Wherever the title of streets and parks may rest, they have immemorially been held in trust for the use of the public and, time out of mind, have been used for purposes of assembly, communicating thoughts between citizens, and discussing public questions. Such use of the streets and public places has, from ancient times, been a part of the privileges, immunities, rights, and liberties of citizens."

SCOTUS further reinforced the First Amendment in Southeastern Promotions, Ltd. v. Conrad, 420 U.S. 546 (1975):

"No matter how many procedural safeguards may be imposed, any system which permits governmental officials to inhibit or control the flow of disturbing and unwelcome ideas to the public threatens serious diminution of the breadth and richness of our cultural offerings."

Just because the idea of open carrying is unwelcomed by some in our state. The fact that you have people exercising their First Amendment rights to defend their Second Amendment rights, in a public space, is as American as apple pie, baseball, and pick-up trucks.

[avmech]

Also, we do not have "constitutional carry" in Florida. We have permitless concealed-only carry and it is very restrictive in nature. You must meet all the criteria for the issuance of a CCW permit to be able to carry without a permit.

True constitutional carry doesn't have such requirements.

Never ceases to amaze me how many "firearm savvy" people do not understand this and go around saying we have constitutional carry